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Phase 7 Commercial,

(105852)
Friday, September 16, 2016 07:14 PM 

Parkview fell from much over 300k to 270
Ivy Green fell and the price gap between IVy commercial and 7Commercial shrank from 25 lac to just a few lac now (read almost same in real sense)
Rahbar commercial fell from almost 235 to 208
Phase 9 commercial Oval complex (although not a file anymore but balloted plots) fell over 50 lac in the same period

The only commercial file that has shown the highest resilience in this slump post taxes is the commercial file of Phase 7 which is still hovering above 255 which is the lowest drop in any of the above mentioned commercial files since end June 16.

Lesson for those not too filled with self praise/egos and of open mind to learn from past mistakes: High performance in the recent past is not the correct yard stick for investments. The correct yard stick to guage the future value of investment is fundamental reality of over priced/over hyped property existing on papers for a distant future vs under valued property nearing completion

;)

Jameel Mughal® replied on Friday, September 16, 2016 07:36 PM 

Well said shah, the issue is forum members are mostly holders and biased towards their own investment not matter what is logic,and that is human nature. There are few which comment based on facts and give true picture.
We have learnt a lot in previous two cycles of hypes and slumps but did not get benefit out of that.

Shah® replied on Friday, September 16, 2016 08:25 PM 

True that Jameel bhai

Following the market hype and then falling is love with that investment decision against all rationale and against all ground reality is the biggest short coming in most investors. But then at the expense of sounding selfish I must say market needs such people who loose money due to this. Otherwise the rest wont make money as without loosers there could be no winners. My apology again to anyone who gets offended with this rather selfish sounding comment. But thats the reality.

HassanHC® replied on Friday, September 16, 2016 09:55 PM 

Jameel Saab then in the same sentence where you have mentioned biases of holders of non Phase 7 plot, mention CMY SAAB also. As many times he proved you why prism is superior overal to phase 7.
Also yes different phases get cooling off but praising each other for holding phase 7 plot for last 2 years is good but at the same time PHASE8 PRISM IVY GREEN PARKVIEW are reality and most of them have been invested by 1000s of investors I am sure they are not as fool and naive as you and Mr Shah think and those investors who held for last 1-2 yrs minimum earned more dollar to dollar compared to phase 7 and let's see in future how much they loose vs your golden investments.

If you will present an inspector like a commissioner on daily basis I will have to differ. Though may be I respect inspector a lot. (Translation I like phase 7 but how you are trying to present it more bigger then it is attract criticism though independently it's not a bad investment)

Shah® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 03:24 AM 

Serious investors are heartless so to speak as far as place of investment is concerned. They dont have affiliations with any particular property or phase. Getting emotional and making every single post on this forum about phase7 vs phase 9 depicts a rather immature mindset on investment matters.

Phase 9 was a great buy last year at last year prices. Many, like me bought at that time. And we sold at peak this year in the first half of the year when prices over shot the realistic level. There will be another time for entry in phase9 but that time is not now.

I personally have no affiliations with either phase7 or phase 9. I have affiliations only with my ROI which is close to 100% in last 12 months (for this part of my portfolio in DHA) by two simple moves:

1. Buying phase 9 when it was the time to buy last year and selling it when it was time to sell in April 16
2. Buying pgase 7 when it was time to buy (Feb 16) and holding it till ballot (which is due some time this year). And then it will be time to sell even this one a d to move on

My sincere advise to the newbee investors here is to not get trapped in their emotional preferences of one pvase over other. Money is made with a cold heart and with numerical logic and ground realities. Not with hot headed emotions clouding your decision. Wise are the one who learn from their mistakes and not get fixated over them. The later kind is the likes of political cannon fodder of the mentality "Shair eik vari fair". Wont do you any good.

Cheers

Jameel Mughal® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 06:22 AM 

Hassan You know Yourself that I am prism investor, though small, As an investor you have your own limits where you feel that this investment got realistic value and more than that is artificial. Advising the people at that point is sincerity not Phase 7ism or Phase 9 Vendetta. To me realistic value of Phase 9 average plot is 90 Lac Full paid. This based upon inflation adjusted value of average Phase 8 price. level he should be Ok, Though market still may undershoot or over shoot. [others have right to disagree]
Because Course of DHA 9 was very long so it was predictable even when Phase 9 was leaping every day.
I have relatively bigger investment in Phase 8 but never advised anyone that it is "best" Investment of day.

Surfer® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 06:27 AM 

@ Shah sb. The teacher.
Thanx for your lesson.
Can I ask you a question?
Why are you comparing your commercials with phase 9 Prism & Ivy green which just balloted last year?
WHAT IS THE REASON BEHIND THIS?
Kindly make an analysis on realistic bases you are very near to phase 8 which is balloted after phase 7. Kindly make comparasion with commercial broadway phase8 to justify yourself & your statement.
Again Reflection of FEAR Comparasion with phase 9 PRISM.
Comparasion of matured Investment with developing one day may harmfull to you in future.
PRISM is a "INVESTOR PARADISE" & remain will untill or unless their is an other phase develop by DHA Lahore Chapter like PRISM.

Ahsan® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 07:23 AM 

@ Jameel Sahib

I highly regard your advice and opinion. Kindly suggest when is the time to enter prism 1 kanal and what is anticipated price in March 2017 of priem 1 kanal? Please guide us.

Ahsan® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 07:23 AM 

@ Jameel Sahib

I highly regard your advice and opinion. Kindly suggest when is the time to enter prism 1 kanal and what is anticipated price in March 2017 of priem 1 kanal? Please guide us.

Jameel Mughal® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 07:29 AM 

Surfer, He is pointing on good investment of the day, not proving that DHA 7 was better than Broadway, All of these investment have potential some have already over shooted and reached @ 2020 price, no matter how good they are, It will not be wise to buy them,
Wisdom is to see what will give you more gain today.

I give you comparison of My observation of Holding One Plot in Valencia and one in Phase 7

2006 end Valencia average 30, Phase 7 average 40 [here I Picked valencia]
2007 end Valencia average 40 Phase 7 average 35
June 2008 Valencia average 42 Phase 7 average 35 [Here I Picked Phase 7@33]
2010 valencia average 45 DHA 7 average 38 [at that time I was stunned as there was lot of on ground development even poles and transformers in Phase 7 ut it was not picking]
2012 end Valencia average 70 DHA 7 average 90
March 2016 Valencia 120 DHA phase 7 115 [It was time to Pick 7]
Sept 2016 Valencia average 125 DHA 7 average 140

Wisdom is not to Pick an investment when it is in hype and keep singing its song, Rather find underpriced areas and invest in time.

Ahsan® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 07:55 AM 

@jameel Sahib

You are a gem on this forum, please share your opinion for central Park and Grand Avenue. I have a plot in central park 1 kanal possession and getting offer of 77 lacs and Grand Avenue near possession for 45 lacs. I feel that they can still grow further or how hard slump will hit them?

Regards Ahsan

Jameel Mughal® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 09:10 AM 

Dear Ahsan,
Don't Touch Central Park it will give you slow gain in spite of slump, Grand Avenue if Your Plot is in Phase 1 and almost developed you may wait, These investment still have good Room to grow.
Grand Avenue have Some land Acquisition issue in phase 2, They have overbooking and may not give possession soon, Another option for you can be to sell it and switch to AWT2 or Sigas 2 in Possession areas.
If I don't have cash Flow issue I will wait keeping in mind sale and purchase expenses.

Shah® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 09:27 AM 

Dear Surfer bro
Kindly read my posts again but as an objective observer. You will find answers to your questions there. I have invested twice in priism and exited twice encashing a decent bag of ROI both times. I will invest again in Prism when It is time to invest again. I neither love nor hate prism, or any other phase for that matter.

Jameel bhai has also correctly mentioned that the purpose of this discussion is not to promote or discourage anything. Everything has its own merits and everything has a time of entry and time of exit.

The purpose of this whole discussion is to highlight that entry and exit times needs to be carefully calculated without emotions and affiliations. I gave numerical data in my first post to support my argument. But one cannot see facts and figures if the mind is clouded by emotions.

Anyways, I hope investors in prism and all other phases recover from their losses. My sincere regards to you all!

Jameel Mughal® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 09:28 AM 

@ overseas
Phase 7 5 Merla T Block, @ 55 to 60
Phase 7 10 merla Y Block @ 95 on 150 Road Avene 14,
Phase 7 10 merla Y Block @ 70 one or 2 lines away from BRB
Phase 7 10 merla Y Block @ 62 near Nallah though there is no smell as no Population or Industry at that point.

For 5 Merla you can also Consider DHA Town Phase 9 same Price as that of phase 7 and Located in heart of Prism possession available but population in DHA 7 may be bit faster.

These are all indicative bargain prices. Keeping in view the current market situation.

KSA Banker® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 09:46 AM 

Dear All, just to second Jameel Sahib's opinion regarding estimated fair prices for Prism one kanal plots, please see below an analysis which I posted few days ago indicating similar results. Hope this helps the potential buyers as well.

Like many of you (followers of this discussion forum), I am a real estate investor and prospective buyer waiting for prices to come down to rational levels before making my intended investment(s). As part of the preparatory work and capitalizing on my limited financial and investment analysis skills, I did a simple simulation to try to estimate “target return based” fair prices for canal plots in Prism today.

The methodology adopted for this simulation is that after a certain number of years (holding period), prism will develop into a mature phase (say like DHA Phase-5 today) and upon reaching such maturity, prices of plots in Prism will be comparable to current prices in Phase-5 adjusted for inflation during the holding period. By assuming certain average inflation rate per year and current estimated prices in Phase-5, we can project the potential prism prices at the end of the holding period. By discounting the value of the plot at the end of the holding period at the target rate of return per year, we can estimate what is maximum price we should pay for the plot today in order to achieve the target rate of return. The development charges yet to be paid are also taken into consideration as additional cost for buyer in this analysis along with transaction costs (agent fees, taxes etc.).

For the sake of this simulation, canal plots in prism are divided into five categories which are (i) best locations, (ii) great locations, (iii) good locations, (iv) average locations and (v) poor locations.

The analysis is done based on US dollar values as inflation rate is more predictable.

Following are the key assumptions for the analysis:
- Current plot prices in Phase-5 for above categories are (i) Best at US$ 355 thousand, (ii) great at US$ 315 thousand, (iii) good at US$ 280 thousand, (iv) average at US$ 240 thousand and (v) poor at US$ 200 thousand
- Annual growth (inflation) of above mature prices is assumed at 2.5%
- Target rate of return is assumed at 10% per year
- Holding period is assumed at 15 years (estimated time for Prism to reach the maturity level in which Phase-5 is today)
Based on the above assumptions, the maximum prices (including transaction charges) which may be rational to pay today for the five categories of plots in Prism to achieve the target return are estimated as (i) best at US$ 110 thousand, (ii) great at US$ 95 thousand, (iii) good at US$ 85 thousand, (iv) average at US$ 70 thousand and (v) poor at US$ 56 thousand.
I thought of sharing the above analysis with other readers of this forum with the hope that it may help other potential buyers like me to make a bit more informed and rational decision based on some degree of analysis

Kamal Baig® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 03:15 PM 

AOA
Jameel sb

I was sale out my 10 marla plot of NFC2 F block on 28.5 lac cost of land in start of this year and purchased 5 Malra in best location in EMC on 23 lac , which is now near 33 lac. Please tell me now what will best time to enter again in NFC2?

Jameel Mughal® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 04:25 PM 

You mean KEMC??
Best time in NFC is when this admin will change they are afraid of Audit, I think Like Valencia Registrar Cooperatives should appoint its member to rectify their sate of Affairs, The Only Issue in NFC2 is that they are short of Money to develop and that is natural, development Cost in 2005 and 2016 cat be 6 lac. There are no other serious issues,

Jameel Mughal® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 06:04 PM 

Adil, Any rate below 35 will be Good, go for allocation file and intend should be long term holding, minimum 5,7 years. keep in mind that smaller cities are more affected by slump and rate of population is slow.
other investment with similar Budget is DHA Phase 9 prism J Block good Locations, At the end of 7 years both could give you same ROI, In prism you will pay 9X75K development, and Multan yo will pay 1.6 to 1.9 Million development Charges.

User_12115® replied on Saturday, September 17, 2016 06:43 PM 

@Jameel sb..
I beg to differ, small cities see less slump and history is evident of it.
neither of any slump in last few decades effected markets like Multan. Their growth was lesser than lahore but when lahore fell, Multan market held on to its prices.
You can compare Multan Cantonment prices of those times - they are still higher than Lahore cantonment as it is considered a posh area and available land is limited.

Bilal® replied on Sunday, September 18, 2016 06:43 AM 

I like Jameel sb's sincere opinions! No strings attached:)


His advised properties gained better.

Uber replied on Sunday, September 18, 2016 09:45 AM 

Jameel sb, I would be keen to get in touch with you. Is there a way I could get some sort of contact/email

IM786® replied on Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:52 AM 

Yes Plz jameel Sb give ur email address if u would like to.
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