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Wednesday, March 11, 2009 05:17 PM PST 
Eid e Miladun Nabi (peace be upon him)

Continue from 42388 ...

Mr. Friend : I would like to know the brand of Alcohol you drank before writing this message. All Bidaat lead to hell fire, and you are happy with HELL FIRE? strange...

Mr. Anwar Ahemed : Do you respect our Prophet (peace be upon him) more than Sahaba (RA), who never thought of celebrating "Another new" Eid on Rabi ul Awwal, even when the month came every year.

Mr. Atif Latif : our Prophet (peace be upon him) ordered Hazrat Ali (RA) to demolish every elevated grave, after conquring Macca. All such pictures of graves showing "High rise" graves are not of Rasul Allah (peace be upon him). If you want to see how is the grave of Prophet (peace be upon him) looks like please go to Madina Munawara and see the graves of Shuhada e Uhad and graves in Janat ul Baqi

Remaining answers to follow Insha Allah..

mm replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 05:32 PM PST 

Mr. Advisor : Thank you for your advice. Islam teaches us to follow the Sunnah of the Prophet (peace be upon him) and not to create new things in the name of "Tolerance and patience". Celebration of "Birthdays" are the rituals of Christians and Jews, and not of Muslims. URS Sharif, MILAD etc are all derived from them. People who celebrate the EID E MILAD UN NABI (peace be upon him) forget to pray when while they are busy in singing the Indian song type NAAT, till late night.

Mr. Observer : If we all mind our own business, then how can we define Evil and Sin. Do you tolerate your son drinking alcohol inside your home by just saying it is his business and I'll not interfere. It is the duty of all of us to stop such practices

Mr. Mehrtex : Wahabi is derived from WAHAB, a glorious name of Allah Taala. Every Muslim should be proud to be WAHABI. Good practicing Muslims never celebrate their own or their relatives birthdays. Please give us any authentic proof that Angels have another duty to celebrate Milad un Nabi (peace be upon him).

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 05:57 PM PST 

I have no issue with "eid miladul nabi (SAWW)", but have a question, so far i remember there is one weak riwayat about 9 rabi awal, & but no riwayat about 12 rabi awal as a birthdate of Prophet Muhammad (SAWW). But very strong riwayat about 12 rabi awal as a date on which Prophet Muhamamd (SAWW) left this world. So what will be the meaning of Celerbrating 12 Rabi awal? (Apart from Prophet Muhammad (SAWW) & Sahaba (R.A) done or not)

@Mr. Observer

As a muslim no one can mind his own business (when it comes to Islamic Deed) since Quran says this line

"U are the best Nation, because u tell people to do good deeds, and try to stop them for doing bad deeds"

Observer replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:27 PM PST 

All Beardos

You must also thin Quran teaches us to burn cd shops, destoy barber shops, beat up women and stop kids from going to school.

I am afraid a lot of people do not want all that.

Atif Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:37 PM PST 

Everyone:

As far the religion is concerned, we should ONLY do what Prophet Mohammad (Peace Be Upon Him) and his pious companions (May Allah Be Please with all of them) had done.

Can all my brothers who are supporting the so-called Eid-e-Milad say "Yes" to any of the following questions?

1. Did Prophet Mohammad (Peace Be Upon Him) celebrate the Milad in his life (prove must be from Sahih Hadiths)?

2.Did any of the four Caliphs or any of the pious companions (May Allah Be Please with all of them) of Prophet Mohammad (Peace Be Upon Him)celeberate Milad?

3. Did any of the Tabaieen (May Allah Be Please with all of them)i.e. the followers of pious companions (May Allah Be Please with all of them)celeberate Milad?

If the answer is "Yes" to any of the questions above, we should also celeberate, otherwise, we should follow Prophet Mohammad (Peace Be Upon Him) and his pious companions (May Allah Be Please with all of them)

Observer replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:42 PM PST 

Its a CHOICE to celebrate or not.

No one should be forced to celebrate or stopped from celebrating.

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:44 PM PST 

@Observer

I am afraid also, but i guess u don't read Quran (like those alot of people who don't want like this as u mentioned) ,if u would then you wont be saying that, still just a short answers what exactly Islam/Shariah says about these all acts...

1) CD Shops - "State" should ban movies, cinema, cd shops, etc.. no xyz, such as a Mullah like me is authorized to stop (by hand) for this. Also "Amar Bil Marouf, Nahin Anal munqar" only include dawah, not stoping my force...
2) Barbr shops - There is no clause for "Destroying barbr shops"(not even for the state), but just to do dawah for the bread is important, since according to all Imam's it is compulsory (fraz).
3) Beat up women - It is not premisable, if it hurt women, or leaves marks on her body.. also u can't beat women (wife only) for non shariah reasons.. & it is the last resort, if still She remains doing non shariah act, then u should leave her.. rather then beating her more hardly..
4) Stop kids from education - It is compulsory (fraz) of every Muslim to get education, even u Mr. Observer, to know what actually Islam says about it, rather then just babling around, without knowledge..(I never meant offense, but just wanted to inform u)

Observer replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 07:15 PM PST 

@Waqar

Please see below my reply

1)I love watching cds and would not give up no matter what you shout or whatever interpretation of Quran and Islam you bring
2) I would not keep a beard and would not stop you having one either but from experience I know its hypocrites forcing others to do what they consider is right making themselves exception
3) You have an interesting take on Women beating; lets see what you would do if taliban police beat you up without leaving a mark on your body if they found you on the wrong side of their 'shariah'
4) Education do not only means reading and reciting Quran but also conquering the vast universe with the power of knowledge, improving healthcare, help create a tolerant society

Finally its all about one person's interpretation against another's. If you turn back and tell me I am Kafir because of disagreement on fundamental things then I have no problem ignoring the likes of you.

Ali replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 07:33 PM PST 

Allah has clearly said not to add or less anything in our religion simply because one can easily astray and it can count as SHIRK or BIDA. There is no riwayat of celebrating Eid-e-Milad Un Nabi (SAWW). Our beloved prophet (SAWW) never taught to celebrate his birthday neither the Sahabas did after him.

We are too busy in watching movies, listening songs, doing business, spending time on computer chatting and playing games that we forget to offer pray, we don’t have time to read Quran, read Sunnah of our Prophet (SAWW) and Ahadees..

Its every ones business to spread ISLAM and to teach ISLAM since every person of our Prophet’s (SAWW) ummah is a DAI (preacher) by birth. We should be proud that we have been given such a big responsibility that was done by Anbias and we should spread the true message of Islam not by introducing new things in Islam.

Mr observer there is no choice when it comes to observe Allah’s (SWT) order and follow the sunnah of our prophet (SAWW). Islam has not been spread vigorously it needs time and patience. No one can force you to stop watching CDs or have a beard no one can even take you to the mosque unless you want to. For doing that no one can even say you a KAFIR since we have not been taught to call some one a Kafir.

I pray that Allah shows us the right path and gives us taufeeq AMEEN..


Allah knows the best
Wasalm.

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:08 PM PST 

@Observer

My replies

1) Its your choice to chose what ever you like.. my responsibility was just to tell you
2) Read above!!
3) Well, Talibans are not responsible for my deeds, but yes if State find me doing wrong deeds (social one) then they are authorized to punish me, like if i do stealing then they are authorized to cut my hands, if I do zanna then they are authorize to strip me 100 times, and so o on.. Similarly i am responsible for my wife...
4) Lolzz.. where exactly i said ONLY? or used word ONLY.. u should really read what i am writing .I have just given a example...

Nope, it is not all about one person's interpretation, the Law of Islam is clear, & we have Quran & Hadith in front of us, we don't need interpretation for that (Just to satisfy ourselves). & also i am no one to decide whether u are kaffir or muslim. It u who knows what you are & Allah who can decide who you are.

Info for Muslims replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:11 PM PST 

Is it really true that Muslims are been told not to celebrate the birth of their beloved Prophet (pbuh).

Want to get the answers from Quran and Hadiths:

http://www.drkhalid.co.uk/Eid%20Meelad%20an%20Nabi.pdf


This was printed in the Gulf Times.

As a consequence of the comprehensive implementation of the religion of Islam, no devotional act or religious ceremonies can be initiated into it unless it has a basis in the conduct of the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam. Mankind have been commanded by Allah to do no more than the following: to worship Allah alone; to offer him sincere devotion; and to be true in faith.
Thus, whoever attempts to worship Allah with any act that He has not prescribed will have that act rejected by Him. The Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam said: “He who performs any deed which is not according to what we are upon (i.e., the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam and his companions) then it is rejected.” Such acts are held as innovations in the sight of the lawgiver and every innovation is misguidance.
Among the innovations introduced into this religion is the celebration of the birthday of the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam, which is celebrated in the month of Rabee’ Al-Awwal. People gather in the mosques or stay within their homes on the twelfth night of that month and send salutations upon the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam with innovated phrases as well as reciting laudatory poems and prose which concern him.
These poems and prose are excessively commendatory and exceed the limits that were defined by the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam. Some people even spend their nights cooking certain types of food, to be served on this occasion. Thus, they uselessly spend their time and money in matters that are not prescribed either by Allah or His Messenger sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam, nor were practiced by the four rightly-guided caliphs after him, nor any other of the Muslims who were from the first three distinct generations, whose merit was attested to by the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam.
If these innovations were of any benefit, then surely the pious early Muslims would have preceded us in them? If they were meritorious then surely Allah would never have deprived the early Muslims, including the rightly-guided caliphs of them? The fact of the matter is that this practice was first introduced by people who lived during the fourth Hijri century.
Shaykh Al-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah, may Allah have mercy upon him, said in his book Iqtidaa’ As-Siraat Al-Mustaqeem Mukhaalafatu Ashaabu Al-Jaheem [The Implication of the Straightforward Way Is to Contradict the Companions of the Fire]: “Some people, due to their imitation of what the Christians do on the claimed birth-date of ‘Eesaa (Jesus), peace be upon him, or because of their love of the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam or out of their wish to glorify him, celebrate the Prophet’s birthday. This is despite the fact that there is controversy among the scholars regarding the exact date of his birth. The early Muslims did not practice this, although there was good reason to honour and express their love of the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam and no preventing factors existed. Thus, if the celebration of the Prophet’s birthday was something meritorious, they would have had a better right to precede us in this, as their love and esteem of the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam was far greater than ours. Also, they were far keener to perform good deeds in general than we were.
Loving and esteeming the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam was thus represented by the early Muslims in following his methodology, obeying him, applying his Sunnah inwardly and outwardly, propagating his mission and striving in this cause with their hearts, bodies and tongues.
Most of those who instigate religious innovations are heedless when it comes to the application of the well-known principles that were brought by the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam. They are like those who ornament the Qur’an but do not recite it, or recite it but do not follow its teachings.”
O Muslims! The innovation of celebrating the Prophet’s birthday, which is done on the twelfth night of the month of Rabee’ Al-Awwal, has no historical basis. In fact, historians have differed greatly on the actual birth date of the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam. Some have said that it was on the second of Rabee’ Al-Awwal , others said the eighth, ninth, tenth, twelfth, seventeenth or twenty-second; thus making up seven different opinions. None of these opinions have any evidence which would make them take priority over others.
Moreover, the innovation of celebrating the birthday of the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam has no religious basis. Neither the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam nor any of his Companions or the followers did so. In fact, the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam said: “You must hold fast to my Sunnah and the Sunnah of the four Rightly-Guided Caliphs – cling to it stubbornly. Beware of innovations, for every innovation is misguidance.” (Abu Daawood, Tirmidhi).
Religious celebrations, festivals and other such occasions which glorify Allah and His Messenger are acts of worship. Only that which Allah has prescribed among these is considered to be from the pure Shari’ah, or Islamic law. None of these events can be taken as a means of devotion to Allah except those that have been sanctioned by Allah and His Messenger.

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:12 PM PST 

@Observer

even if i accept ur comments about "choice of celebrating", then can you provide me single authentic proof that 12 Rabi awal was the birth date of Prophet Muhammad (SAWW)? btw i can provide lots of proofs that 12 Rabi Awal was the date when Prophet Muhammad (SAWW) Left this world.

so, what will happen if you actually celebrate the day when "Prophet Muhammad (SAWW) left this world"

Think About it!!!

Aamir replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:34 PM PST 

Muslims can have their personalized “divine guidance” based on their own preferences. Those who like tolerance or want to present Islam as a tolerant religion can quote parts of the Quran that advocates tolerance, while the hardliners, the fundamentalists and even the terrorists can quote those parts of the Quran that foments killing of the disbelievers. Therefore everyone can find what he is looking for in that book. For example if I want to advance the cause of Islam I may Quote the following

2:216 "Fighting is prescribed for you and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But God knoweth and ye know not."
9:29 "Fight those who believe not in God nor the Last Day nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by God and his apostle nor acknowledge the Religion of Truth (even if they are) of the people of the Book, until they pay the Jizya [religious tax] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued
9:5 "... fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem.


But If I want to propagate that Its All Mighty Allah who guides the mankind its not my business I can Quote the following

7.186 Whomsoever Allah sends astray, none can guide him; and He lets them wander blindly in their transgressions

6.111 And even if We had sent down unto them angels (to prove Islam), and the dead (their late relatives) had spoken unto them (testifying their encounter with angels after death), and We had gathered together all things (proofs of Allah's ) before their very eyes, they would not have believed, unless Allah willed.

6.124 Allah knows best whom to send his message of truth (to become Muslim)
6.110 We seal their hearts and turn their eyes away from the truth; we leave them in their transgressions, wandering in perplexity.

Therefore both the school of thoughts are right No need to get emotional

Usher replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:51 PM PST 

@observer

referring to ur questions:

1) I think Waqar clearly talked about Dawah and not to use force

2) Islam tells you to walk on the right path (sirate mustakeem), its entirely upto you how you achieve it but if a gud muslim tells you the right thing then plz dont argue even if you dont want to listen, when you die, u will only take you gud deeds with u

3) again Waqar clearly said about your own wife, and there are many conditions, please read and understand quran

4) Islam doesn't only ask to study quran, quran ask to go out and find allah's naimas, please read and understand quran,

Advisor replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 09:29 PM PST 

Mm/Waqar/usher etc

Your comments are absolutely rubbish. If you want to preach please go some where else. We really don’t need the hated thoughts here.
If I am celebrating “"Eid miladul nabi (SAWW)", it is my personal matter. None of your business! Tell your kids not to celebrate it if you want , please please leave us alone. Do not try to become a “Faroun” on the earth.
Yes we do have enough fanatics in Pakistan and don’t need more. The beauty of Islam is Tolerance and Patience and lets keep this principles in your mind before you post on this forum.

Please be positive!

Observer replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 09:29 PM PST 

Stop living in denial

1) Agreed, if you say no force, just tablighi jamaati coming knocking on my door, I can live with that
2) Ignored, Its a common tactic to scare someone of death before giving them a threatening advice
3) Problem, please tell what are the conditions under which your wife can beat you
4) Partially agree but fact is never in history muslims have stressed on the importance of Knowledge. Before you come back with what muslim scientists have done I would like to point out that most of their work was elementary and infact good but they were not appreciated in their time( current example being Dr Qadeer). Why you think muslims do not have a single invention for the betterment of humankind (or even muslims)in curent age. Why you and I use infidel's internet, mobiles, cars , medicine, machinery, research ....
All we seem to produce is close minded parrtos from madrassahs or govt schoold or a luxury loving elite class from private schools; neither have an ideology.

tzk replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 09:37 PM PST 

Milad-e-Nabi (Yes or No)?

I think the solution is between the two extremes.

People who do not celebrate should not consider those kafir who do that. On the other hand, who want to celebrate, should do it such a way that is in compliance with the teachings of the messanger of Allah (peace be upon him). Avoiding things absolutely against islam such as dancing on the tones of indian songs of even on the tones of "Naat's" or Qawali. The best way to celebrate it is to say Salat(Durud) on the messanger of Allah and read about his teachings (Hadith) and read about his life (Seerat) and see how much we follow his teachings and which actions are against his teachings and which are according to his teachings

Usher replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 09:53 PM PST 

2) its not a tactic, death is a fact, my point was that u only take ur own gud deeds with you,

3) when she stays out all day/nyt wihtout ur permission, when she hang out with other men, when she sells ur kids etc etc

mean, only in extreme situations

islam is not asking to beat ur wife, islam is giving a complete way of life, everything is there black and white

4) and ur point is? its nothing to do with islam, is it? if leaders from muslim countries are busy in making money for themselves and not planning for the future/education then how do u expect gud for that country?

@all & advisor

i m not preaching, just contributing, i m not even a mullah

i think we should stop this conversation right here, because we r not getting anywhere,

apology if any1 didn't like what i wrote,

Usher replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:00 PM PST 

@ Advisor;

I am not saying that we shouldn't celebrate EID MiladunNabi (PBUH), we should definitely celebrate it,

How I celebrated?

I sent durud to our prophet (PBUH), reminded my wife and kid that our prohet (PBUH) were born today, told them that he (PBUH) was last messenger etc

Opinion replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:11 PM PST 

Usher

What actually was asked were conditions when your WIFE can beat you. I think when she finds out you are eyeing the neighbour's wife or when you forget to bring food home, etc.

Its always an excuse saying muslims are in curent state because we dont follow Islam, but its more a case of not relating the religion with real world.

Usher replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:24 PM PST 

@Opinion

sorry fella, didn't read the question properly,

a wife can certainly beat her husband up, if he cheats, if he doesn't luk aftr her and kids, she can simply walk away from him,

my educated guess, if a woman beats her husband, it wont cause a physical damage to him, will it? but if husband beats her back because she hit him first then think how damaging this could be for a woman who is not physicall strong as her husband is,

that is why i think islam ask a woman to walk away from a man

ur second question, give me an example?

Opinion replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:41 PM PST 

An example would be more than 50 muslim countries, and if we go by your argument none following 'real' Islam than it shows Islam is not practicable. Neither current nor past muslims were able to follow it.

On the other hands if we say some (like Saudi) are following Islam than it gives rise to a question that why are they not best or atleast a respectable nation in the world.

Opinion replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:47 PM PST 

My understanding is that we have ritual observation of Islam but in real life we need real skills. Just praying and reciting cant make a difference to material world around us. We need effort and mutual cooperation. Lawyers are doing something thats essentially religious. Even CMY being fair and brining transparency to a notorious profession is islamic. Perhaps we can all be Islamic in our sphere of life but we are all content with Dua and Izkaar.

Usher replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 11:06 PM PST 

@opinion

i wish i was a islamic scholar to answer ur first question

i like ur second post,

islam is a din-e-fitrat, which means its not against our likeness/dislikeness/enjoyment etc

we cannot question everything, can we? like we cannot question our parents that why they brought us to this world etc :-)

Islam doesn't ask you to pray and recite all the time, we have to deal with dunya matters as well,

the following could be done in the light of islam:

* fair trading/business (like developed countries)
* be honest with everyone (like developed countries)
* luking after the needy (state benefits in developed countries)
* research to make life better (like developed countries)
* equal education for everyone (like western world has)

if we follow this, it can make a huge difference after 10-20 years time

Advisor replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 10:42 AM PST 

Clapping for Usher! I love your last post. Hat off for you!

Waqar Latif replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 12:56 PM PST 

After read Usher's Post, A line came into my mind which many MUllah used to say when i was young.. "Western Societies studied Quran & Hadith, and adopt good things thats why they could managed to reach this level"

@Usher

I accept everything, but can't accept Islam is deen-e-fitrat, & it can't go against our likeness/dislikeness etc.. Since by accepting this line i might have to accept that "Drinking Sharab is OK, raping is Ok, doing Zana is Ok, Cutting up Beard is Ok, Listening Music is Ok (Singing & Music are two different things, n another discussion)... & many more"

This is one fitna which many scholars (so called) are spreading around. Basically Islam is a "Complete way of Life, Zabta-e-hayaat" it provide a way to live life. Islam can go against our likes/dislikes.. & it include each & every part of life, like what to do after getting wake-up, how to eat, how to sit, how to walk, how to do business, how to do Job, how to treat ur wife, kids, parents etc, how to be with ur neighbors, every thing (Apart, from farz, nafal, sunnat etc).. where our likeness/dislikeness also includes... like if like to laugh, play games, etc then it is ok, but listening music is not write, but singing is Ok, u need to have sex, no problem just get married & have a sex with ur wife, but not allowed with any other women... u have to earn for ur kids, family.. & everything to support them.. Everything!!!

@Observer
well, for u my words are up.. its ur choice to accept Islamic Laws or reject it.. i can't help it... My duty was to show you right path..

Waqar Latif replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 01:22 PM PST 

@Advisor

I guess u didn't read my comments by any chance.. i asked number of times "show me the proof that 12 Rabi Wal is actually birthdate of Prophet Muhammad (SAWW), but yes there are many proofs abour 12 rabi awal is actually the date when prophet muhammad (SAWW) left this world." SO what does that means? U r celebrating the day when Prophet Muhammad (SAWW) left this world?

mehrtex replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 02:23 PM PST 

Please read this.........

FW: Saudi Arabian Minister endorses Mawlid Celebrations

Arab News

I think celebrating the mawlid of our Prophet, if observed without any sinful practices, is a good innovation (bida’a hasanah) as long as it comes out of good intention (husn al-maqsad), Allah knows best.— Dr. Mohammed Abdo Yamani is Saudi Arabia’s former minister of information



http://www.arabnews .com/?page= 7§ion=0&article=120057&d=9&m=3&y=2009

All praise be to Allah the Almighty, Lord of the Universe, Who honored and praised His last Prophet and Messenger Muhammad, saying: “Verily you have the great manners (morals).” (Qur’an, Al-Qalam: 4)
Peace and prayers flow to our beloved Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), his honorable family and all his Companions, up to the Day of Judgment, Ameen.
I think that it is of vital importance for all of us and especially for our young people and children to know about the very high rank of our Prophet whose birth and advent was a gift from Allah and a mercy to all mankind. Hence, it is important that, on the occasion of his birthday, we should pause to reflect on his Sirah (biography) and tell miracles that took place during and after his birth.

It is a known fact that in Islam there are only two Eids (feasts). These are, namely, Eid Al-Fitr and Eid Al-Adha. But, other Islamic functions such as the mawlid (birthday) of our Holy Prophet, the Prophetic Hijrah (emigration) from Makkah to Madinah, which marked the beginning of a new history of man, the emergence of a new super force, state and community (Ummah), as well as the Prophet’s Isra’a (night journey) from the Sacred Mosque to the Farthest One, are all occasions of great importance for Muslims all over the world. We need to remember and commemorate all these occasions, which remind us of the greatness and high-ranking of our beloved Prophet. When I talk about commemorating these events, this should not be understood that we call on Muslims to turn them into Eids or festivals that involve wrongful practices, which are common in some places in both Muslim and non-Muslim countries.

But, it is also true that we are living at a time when the enemies of Islam are using every possible means to destroy and conquer the Ummah of the Prophet from within and without, with no sign of mercy or conscience, and that there are very few believers, in fact, who are able to confront them. This may be because we have reached a time of a new jahiliyah (period of darkness and ignorance), among both Muslims and non-Muslims, so much that the truth has become a commodity. It is obvious that those who have power in their hands claim that they have the right to defend the truth, in the form they like it to be, propagate and market it. Thus, the truth itself has become a trademark or a fabricated commodity, and one of their innocent victims.

The blood of Muslims in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, Lebanon, Somalia, Pakistan and elsewhere has become cheap to the extent it is not even worth talking about or caring about. As a result, the dignity, sacred symbols and divine values of Muslims have become the main target and the shortest way to name and fame. The Danish cartoons and movie that were designed to defame our Holy Prophet, the recent show on Israeli Channel 10, which included direct insults on both Prophet Muhammad and Jesus Christ (peace be upon them) are but a few examples of the ongoing vigorous campaign against Islam and Muslims.

Hence, it is our duty to make use of every opportunity to show our deep love and veneration for our Holy Prophet, who stands very high and above all in the hearts of believers and those who love the truth. The enemies of Islam should know that any attack on our Prophet will never be acceptable to Muslims and that they will pay for it a very high price.
It is very important for us now to take every occasion to aggrandize our beloved Prophet, speak out to Muslims and non-Muslims about his merits, teachings and judgments on every aspect of life, and tell about the miraculous signs that accompanied his birth. Furthermore, we should take the opportunity of the mawlid to make it clear to all peoples that the religion of Ibrahim, Noah, Jacob, Moses, Sulayman, Dawood, Jesus and Muhammad (peace be upon them all) is one and the same. That Islam is the universal religion for all mankind and that it stands for peace, love, brotherhood, equality, justice and tolerance. We also need to make it clear that the cause of Islam has nothing to do with violence and terrorism; that it is the identity of all lovers of truth, East and West; and that the truth in Islam never changes for the sake of politics, or to suit the purposes of anyone.

For all these reasons, I think celebrating the mawlid of our Prophet, if observed without any sinful practices, is a good innovation (bida’a hasanah) as long as it comes out of good intention (husn al-maqsad), Allah knows best.

— Dr. Mohammed Abdo Yamani is Saudi Arabia’s former minister of information.
He heads several nongovernmental organizations (NGOs).

Usher replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 05:31 PM PST 

@ Waqar Latif

Thanks brother for the detailed explanation,

when I said "din-e-fitrat", i was answering the question "why do we have to do reciting all the time?" there are limits when we say din-e-fitrat, it doesn't cover everything e.g. i want to be a naturist and dont want to wear cloths :-)

definitely Islam gives a complete way of life

ur explanation was alot better, thanks again

i live in the west, western countries never studied quran/hadith, they are working out the right/wrong as they go, they understood the family values now, they are giving proper rights to women (it wasn't the case 20 years ago)

may allah keep us on the right path

Usher replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 05:48 PM PST 

also if western countries had studied islam, they would have converterd to islam
>
(38311)
Wednesday, March 11, 2009 03:01 PM PST 
DHA Lahore Plots File Prices Lahore Real Estate Market Pulse

Lahore Real Estate Market Pulse Mar 11, PM

DHA Lahore Files Prices:

DHA Lahore Phase 5 M Block Allocation File 1 Kanal seller at 30.50 Lacs

DHA Lahore Phase 5 Extension Allocation File: Buyer(s) at 24.65 Sellers(s) at 24.75 lacs

DHA Lahore Phase 6 Allocation File Sellers(s) at 34.00 Lacs

DHA Lahore Phase 7 Allocation File Sellers(s) at 20.50 Lacs

DHA Lahore Phase 8 Allocation File Buyer(s) at 33.60 Seller(s) at 33.70 Lacs

Parkview-DHA-8 Lahore 1 kanal allocation TRANSFER file Buyer(s) at 27.35 Seller(s) at 27.45 Please note OPEN files are priced lower.

Parkview-DHA-8 10 Marla allocation Buyer(s) at 19.70 Seller(s)at 19.80 Lacs.

DHA Lahore Phase 9/10 Allocation File Buyer(s) at 14.20 Seller(s) at 14.25


DHA Valley Islamabad open files 5 marla one paid sells at loss of =27,000 TO 29,000

DHA Valley Islamabad open files 8 marla one paid sells at loss of =17,000 TO 19,000

DHA Islamabad Phase 2 extension is at about 10.85 Lacs for lowest priced blocks.



**********************************
***For More Detailed Prices Schemes Click Here***

***For Past Prices History Click Here***
**********************************

< Always deal with Registered/Authorized Dealers only >

Rates you can trust provided by:




Ch. Mujahid Yasin (CMY)
Lahore Real Estate
Registered/Authorized Dealer (DHA, EMAAR, Bahria Town, Urban Developers, etc.)
+92-300-400-9967
+92-322-400-9967
eMail: LRE786@GMail.com

http://www.LahoreRealEstate.com

SS - KSA replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:50 PM PST 

Dear CMY,

Please advice the price after two paid for:

DHA Valley Islamabad open
files 5 marla
DHA Valley Islamabad open files 8 marla

You are doing great job for us, Overseas Pakistani. Keep up good work.
Thanks!

CMY Rates Update replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 02:37 AM PST 

Lahore Real Estate Market Pulse Mar 11, PM at Close of The Day.



DHA Lahore Phase 5 Extension Allocation File: Buyer(s) at 24.65 Sellers(s) at 24.75 lacs



DHA Lahore Phase 8 Allocation File Buyer(s) at 32.80 Seller(s) at 32.90 Lacs

Parkview-DHA-8 Lahore 1 kanal allocation TRANSFER file Buyer(s) at 27.30 Seller(s) at 27.40 Please note OPEN files are priced lower.

Parkview-DHA-8 10 Marla allocation Buyer(s) at 19.90 Seller(s)at 20 Lacs.

DHA Lahore Phase 9/10 Allocation File Buyer(s) at 14.15 Seller(s) at 14.20



< Always deal with Registered/Authorized Dealers only >

Rates you can trust provided by:




eMail: LRE786@GMail.com

Lahore Real Estate
Registered/Authorized Dealer (DHA, EMAAR, Bahria Town, Urban Developers, etc.)
http://www.LahoreRealEstate.com
>
(38310)
Wednesday, March 11, 2009 12:05 PM PST 
purchase of land

Ad Type
City
Scheme
Phase
Wanted
lahore
dha
8
dear brother if any body is willing to sell a file of phase 8 for 30 lacs please contact me at my e mail.

kakay zai replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 09:29 PM PST 

any1 interested 2 sell the file at 30.50,hard cash,please
contact on email

payment can be done in foriegn currency
>
(38309)
Wednesday, March 11, 2009 05:12 AM PST 

Current geo-political situation demands a very close cooperation between Pak army and the political party in power. PPP understood this very well but this Taghgha of PML(N) does not get it. Mush is not Yahya Khan, Pak army will not abandon Mush and U.S. cannot abandon Pak army. Had this Taghgha shown soft side to Mush now, he would have gotten all the PML (Q) leadership lined after him. A united PMLs would have been in a better position to handle Swat and FATA situation than PPP.

play the game as it plays replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 07:22 AM PST 

zardari a true politican. he was calm and collected during all this time and nawaz as always being over emotional.in this forum and no matter what you like or dislike zardari . he is the winner in this tamasha.nawaz and imran have to learn , in a nation where things are corrupt from a baangee to ultimate mr late ziaulhaq, you have to play this tamasha like all do example is fazular rehman.

God sake dont tell me that nawaz is a saint. but play it as it plays dont cry.

Fahad replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:24 AM PST 

Very Right... Mr. Play the game as it plays...

Nawaz is not a saint... he is may be 10% less corrupt.

I guess its time for simple and common people to come forward instead of choosing an other wadaira or industrailist stealing govt funds.

yesss replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 11:16 AM PST 

Zardari obediently kneels to American demands. America does NOT want N. Sharif to have power. Sharif does not kneel so he must be contained or worse .....

Azam (lahore) replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:01 PM PST 

I dis-agree in toto ! Things are going to improve drastically.President's powers among other things will be curtailed/rectified through constitutional amendments.Sharif's will be re-instated and Zardari will fade away in a few months after being made toothless. A more acceptable ppp leadership will be put in place and a balance will be created amongst the polital parties in terms of power sharing.This is all pressure politics (a political tamsaha towards resolution of all the above issues)

Truth replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:12 PM PST 

Whatever is happening is bad for the country. People dont care which party comes on top as long as their problems are addressed. Ordinary people are caught up in bread and butter issues, thanks to the prudent policies of our 'economic wizards' and leaders are busy in their dirty games as usual. So many schools, colleges and hospitals could be built with the money that is being used in wheeling dealing these days but unfortunately who is there to think about the common people? Everyone has his own axe to grind. Everyone is following his own agenda. Fahad is right. Nobody is saint here. But the problem is that a person who does not follow 'their' programme wont come into power. These leaders are pawn in the hands of foreign masters. Now one would argue that its not their fault if our people are ready to sell their loyalties to masters. True. When our own leaders have vested interests and personal objectives then it is easy to lure such leaders.

Silent Spectator replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:44 PM PST 

@ play the game as it plays

Well said "Nawaz is not a saint". But Zardari is a "saint". You like people have sealed the fate of this nation. You are supporting a person who has not honoured his commitments and nobody in the country or ouside, is going to believe him or giving any importance to his utterances and his agreements. What a crown country is wearing at the hands of Mr. Ten percent.

Saiful Azam, Lahore replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 02:06 PM PST 

IP:
confirmed news...

ARMY TO DECLARE STATE OF EMERGENCY IN NEXT 48 HOURS.

FRESH ELECTIONS TO BE ANNOUNCED.

limo replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 03:23 PM PST 

Saiful Azam, its hard to believe and is no solution to the recent crisis.Instead matters should be resolved through negociations putting personal egoes aside. It will surely lift the stature of our infamous politicians who are considerd worst when it comes to solving issues through talks.Abrar you said it right, had Nawaz acted a bit sensibly, he would have been in much better position today.I wish Nawaz gives a little thought to what Ejaz ul Haq said yesterday that "Nawaz should show some magnanimity and go to Ch. brothers for patch up".I also wish Ex. CJ gives a little thought to what Ch.Shujaat Hussain said yesterday "Ex. CJ should also be ready to sacrifice a bit in the interest of the country".I personally feel this is the high time for both of these individulas Ex.CJ and Nawaz to put their egoes aside and prove to the nation that "Pakistan comes first".

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 03:31 PM PST 

@Play

may be this is a game for u, but check this snap..

http://thenews.com.pk/updates_pics/_l.gif

for him it is not a game, but reality, and a fight for survival. No doubt NZ is not a "Saint", but he is one hope for the betterment.

@others,

do watch this snap..
http://thenews.com.pk/updates_pics/_l.gif

atiq raja replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 05:29 PM PST 

same old story,marsala is comming very soon.nawaz is stupid person.

Amjad replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 07:28 PM PST 

Mr.Waqar Latif, I think you have a 'Zardari Fobia'. When every body know Nawaz Sharif has no brain and due to his stupidness PPP is ruling all over the country, then please let me know who is the good politician, your without brain Nawaz or Zardari? Now this time army is not behind Nawaz, Zardari have a complete support of army this time because of certain reasons and that you dont know.Please try to understand if you have a brain.

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:22 PM PST 

Amjad, agree i do have a "Zardari Fobia" & also agree that this is NZ's fault who actually trusted a proven lier back in march last year, and because of NZ's that decision we have to face this thing .. but R u denying that "NZ is a hope to get rid of this Zardari"? R u denying "Zardari has broken the promise which he made 3 times (also one infront of Quran)?" Which makes NZ Stand on the principle!!

Apart, i agree NZ is also a corrupt person. As most of the pakistanis leaders are (because of this corrupt system can lead only corrupt people to come up). But I wanna get rid of this stupid (proven hypocrite) zardari, on any cost!!

Lastly, I don't know Army is on which side.. neither i do care about that.. Nor i anywhere something related to army.. so ur comments don't make sense..

Amjad, be sincere to urself, rather then a blind jiyala.

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:30 PM PST 

& Amjad, it is pretty surprising for me that you don't have "Zardari fobia" after looking at current situation made by "Kabari".. or may be u are also among those corrupt people who toke max advantage of being "Stupid Jiyala"

Zardari (Wrath of God) replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:38 PM PST 

A religious scholar went to Zardari's place and Said, " Please do not tease the people otherwise the wrath of God will come (Urdu: Makhlooq ko mat tang karo warna Azabe-e-Illahi aaye ga)".


Zardari responded, "Dear respected, it was Musharraf who was teasing the people, humbly, I AM the Wrath of God (Urdu: Tang to Musharraf kar raha tha, Main tu Azab Hoon)".

Silent Spectator replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:54 PM PST 

PPP stalwarts and some other people are stressing for negotiations and table talks. This is good to have table talks, but with whom who does not care to honour the commitments made in table talks. Lot of table talks were held at Bhoorban, Islamabad, Lahore, London, Dubai but Mr. Ten percent, did not honour any of the commitments he made. Now with whom the table talks are to be held? And who will guarantee that the agreements will be honoured?

molvi replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 12:18 AM PST 

ZOORDAR, President after
Farooq Nalaik will be Chairman Senat after
Sheri Rehman willbe Dy. chairman SENat after
Gallani go to home
Zoordari Sister will be PM after
Kiyalni will go to home after
Rehaman Malik will be Chief of Army Staff after

IF MOULLNA WILL COOPERATE WITH ZARDAR IN SENAT

HE WILL FALL IN KHADDA
ALLAH HEE HAFIZ

IF MOULLNA WILL COOPERATE WITH ZARDAR IN SENAT
>
(38308)
Wednesday, March 11, 2009 03:05 AM PST 

Major crackdown tonight on PML N and others leaders and members to stop march. Ch Iftikhar to be evicted tonight. Army and rangers on the move in all cities of Punjab.

Informer replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 03:15 AM PST 

Motorway will be blocked with containers on all entry and exit points. Police have been ordered to arrest 1000s of leaders from PML N and Jamat Islamai and Tehreek e Insaf.

ashraf replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 03:22 AM PST 

NOT GOOD for the country.i am with PPP and knew BB very well, but today i feel PPP needs to change its leadership. this is not Bhutto saab PPP any more.

Rehmat ali replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 03:44 AM PST 

I was a strong supporter of PPP but after knowing Zardari on top, I dislike PPP. Benazir's biggest mistake she married Zardari wh ruied ner family including he brother andherself.

Observer replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:41 AM PST 

I suspend my PPP support until the day Zardari is kicked out from PPP

yesss replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 07:49 AM PST 

I don't support PPP or the thief who leads it.
MARCH !! MARCH !!!

Hamid,Toroto replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:27 AM PST 

Same here! No more PPP support while Zardari is in power. There is no doubt that PPP is a national level Party but Mr. Zardari is ruining the party. In near future I am seeing that PPP will be divided into several groups.

yesss replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:40 AM PST 

Just read the Sharif brothers and Imran Khan are all under house arrest. Things are looking VERY SCARY right now. Zardari is either going to declare Martial Law and become a dictator OR he will be thrown out of office. I pray he is thrown out of office.

Zardari is an antique. Pakistan needs "youthful" leadership, not a dusty cracked empty-headed antique.

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 12:37 PM PST 

@information

Last night i drive through motorway, all from Mardan to Lahore, but couldn't find anything like u mentioned.

Saeed Ashraf, Islamabad replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 02:05 PM PST 

IP:
ARMY TO DECLARE STATE OF EMERGENCY IN NEXT 48 HOURS.

FRESH ELECTIONS TO BE ANNOUNCED.

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 03:24 PM PST 

@Saeed

What is ur source? btw i think Army will not declare emergency until long march actually happens and it mush contain more then a million people..

jiala since 1979 replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 04:52 PM PST 

i was a strong ppp worker and will be until my death as long as it has same flag same nishan teer and same manshoor.jiay ppp jiay pakistan jiay zardari pakistan khappay.

mahmood replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 05:12 PM PST 

I am by birth PPP (Z.Bhatto and BB)but ZARDAR is hacker of PPP killer of BB baynazeer Bhatto?

Now we will join to Fatima Bhatto, the real WARIS of Bhatto family

Furious replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:39 PM PST 

Jiala since 1979

Just goes to show you are a grave worshipping close minded person who would not change his opinion even Zardari was to rape your family (at present he is raping the whole country).

Amjad replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 07:14 PM PST 

Nawaz sharif was born without brain, Zardari used him like a condom and you can see where is Nawaz now. PPP is ruling all over the country and there is no threat of army interference because USA and Westeren powers are supporting present elected government due to the threat from Alqaida and Talibaan. I hope this so called long march of Nawaz and liar lawyers will be failed. Just wait 5 days more.

Waqar Latif replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 08:42 PM PST 

@Amjad

Sorry to disappoint u!! even ur so called leaders thinks otherwise, they think the long march will be a success.. that's why they started cracked down on PML-N, NSF, JUI, & lawyers & prepared to block GT Roads, Section 144 in Sindh & Punjab.. :P

Amjad replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 09:37 PM PST 

Attention Waqar Latif Dharna is not allowed even in UK or any other democratic country of the world. Please try to understand this kind of protest is not allowed all over the world. Other political parties(except N Leauge) had not participated in the general elections and are in the habit of destabalizing the country after it they join army dictators governments. Especially, Jamati islami has a history of it. I request you not to cry always for Nawaz Sharif. My honest opinion is that no leader at present is sincere to the poor people of Pakistan.Nobody thinks their problems and beleive me Pakistan has become a jahannum for poor people.

as replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 11:48 PM PST 

ppp is anti- pakistan

Amjad replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 12:03 AM PST 

Att.Mr.Ass, good, due to this reason people of Pakistan cast their votes in his favour. Please dont be so prajudis.

as replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 04:06 AM PST 

shut up mazarey.

Amjad replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 04:41 AM PST 

Thanks my feudel Mr. Ass.

Waqar Latif replied on Thursday, March 12, 2009 01:14 PM PST 

@Amjad

1st i am not crying, but i can see tears+fear in the eyes of the government & there supporters.

2nd i don't know it is allowed in different countries or not but i know it happened in pakistan for number of times, in zia regime, in PPP 1st tenor, PML-N 2nd tenor etc... & u r forgetting it was ur BB who initially call for dharna in back 2007, when she said we wont leave our place until Musharaf remove his uniform, & put CJ back on his seat.. So he was calling whole pakistani people for illegal thing?

Give up Amjad, since each time when i will be out of replies then i will come back to BB, since u urself not following her will.. neither u guyz are interested in searching for the killer of her.

Also, if u do listen last night's Alim online then u will get to know what many scholars do say about ur "Kabari"
>
(38307)
Wednesday, March 11, 2009 02:06 AM PST 
.

Ad Type
City
Scheme
For Rent
Lahore
Gulberg
.
>
(38306)
Wednesday, March 11, 2009 12:08 AM PST 
DHA Lahore Plots File Prices Lahore Real Estate Market Pulse

Lahore Real Estate Market Pulse Mar 10, PM

DHA Lahore Files Prices:

DHA Lahore Phase 5 M Block Allocation File 1 Kanal seller at 30.50 Lacs

DHA Lahore Phase 5 Extension Allocation File: Buyer(s) at 24.65 Sellers(s) at 24.75 lacs

DHA Lahore Phase 6 Allocation File Sellers(s) at 34.00 Lacs

DHA Lahore Phase 7 Allocation File Sellers(s) at 20.50 Lacs

DHA Lahore Phase 8 Allocation File Buyer(s) at 33.80 Seller(s) at 33.85 Lacs

Parkview-DHA-8 Lahore 1 kanal allocation TRANSFER file Buyer(s) at 27.35 Seller(s) at 27.45 Please note OPEN files are priced lower.

Parkview-DHA-8 10 Marla allocation Buyer(s) at 19.70 Seller(s)at 19.80 Lacs.

DHA Lahore Phase 9/10 Allocation File Buyer(s) at 14.15 Seller(s) at 14.20


DHA Valley Islamabad open files 5 marla one paid sells at loss of =27,000 TO 29,000

DHA Valley Islamabad open files 8 marla one paid sells at loss of =17,000 TO 19,000

DHA Islamabad Phase 2 extension is at about 10.80 Lacs for lowest priced blocks.



**********************************
***For More Detailed Prices Schemes Click Here***

***For Past Prices History Click Here***
**********************************

< Always deal with Registered/Authorized Dealers only >

Rates you can trust provided by:

:pkf


Ch. Mujahid Yasin (CMY)
Lahore Real Estate
Registered/Authorized Dealer (DHA, EMAAR, Bahria Town, Urban Developers, etc.)
+92-300-400-9967
+92-322-400-9967
eMail: LRE786@GMail.com

http://www.LahoreRealEstate.com
>
(38305)
Tuesday, March 10, 2009 06:38 PM PST 

Dear CMY

Would you kindly advise me on this. I applied for an 8 Marla plot in DHA Valley Overseas Block Islamabad and unfortunately received a letter from DHA that I got it.

I paid US$ 1100. US$250 non-refundable and US$ 850 for something else. I want to get back my US$ 850. How can I get it? or whether I can get it back at all.

Regards.

AA replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 08:54 PM PST 

Dear Friend,
Let us cry to-gether, I am also in same situation. or just wait for anohter trap from DHA.

regards replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 11:13 PM PST 

is it possible for all applicants to cry to-gether and never submitt halt the installments?

or send a petition to CJ Suprem Court of Pakistan if not Suprem Court of Pakistan that send Petition to Sufi Mohammad, SWAT?

Best regards

CMY replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 11:57 PM PST 

Amjad Ali sahib take your loss while its still small and never fall for Infomercials and newspaper ads in future. Do a lot of research before investing your money NOT AFTER the investments are made.

If I had one plot here I wont pay any installments that will just increase my losses. If I had DHA Valley I would sell them and buy DHA Islamabad Phase 2 Extension one kanal lowest priced allocation letter.

Azher UK replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 12:33 AM PST 

Mr. Amjad Ali,
Sorry for your losses but brother why did you jump into the den of crocodile? CDA and all the other DAz are monster crocodile, you fed them "ZEERA" ($850), now pleasedon't try to put your arm into the mouth of crocodile, your arm will be od you good health and forbids that, Allahtallah will give you more strength and energy to make up the losses.

I am not DHAI Broker replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:15 AM PST 

Brother Amjad Ali,

Do not listen to the commentators, when you apply you know that DHAI plots are on installment for 3.5 years. Wait 3.5 years and than see.

Ask the all commentators that they offer you less than 1 Lakh/marla in any housing society where there are same facilities offering DHAI.

Even WANA you will find the same rates, but wait for your investment
>
(38304)
Tuesday, March 10, 2009 03:37 PM PST 
Transfers of a vehicle on your name - An important information

Dear All,
Salaam,

Due to security problems in the country, Govt. has issued an ordinance for transferring process of cars and other vehicles from one person to another. There will be a requirement that both the seller and buyer must be present in the registration office for finalization of this process.

Moreover a policy for heavy fine and challans is announced for incomplete documents. Open letters will NOT be acceptable anymore after March 16, 2008.

This rule will be applicable from March 17, 2009.
===============
P.S. I am sorry that I could not yet find an official source of this information to provide here but it is a confirmed news.

Traveler replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 10:23 PM PST 

Kaisrani sahib I am still waiting for your reply to my Sector C post, kindly tell when these Villas will be launched and what there expected price might be.

Expat replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:17 AM PST 

Dear friends, what is the satus of Gulmahar?
Is possesion granted?
Many thanks in advance.

Traveler replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 02:10 AM PST 

Expat sahib I don't think possession will be granted in Gulmaher before the completion of the Villas in it. I think house construction might an obstruction for these Villas. BT is developing different and far away pieces of land like Tulip and Janipar connecting Sector C but they are not finishing off there ready developed areas such as Gulmehar and Iras and half of Tulip block, maybe thye want to hand them over after a few houses have been constructed in Gulbahar and Jasmine blocks.
>
(38303)
Tuesday, March 10, 2009 03:33 PM PST 
Eid_e_ Milad_un_Nabi Mubarak (Salallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam)

To all brothers and sisters

mm replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 05:50 PM PST 

Aoa celebration of Eid_e_ Milad_un_Nabi Mubarak (Salallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam) is a Bidat. Never celebrated by Rsul Allah (Salallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam) himself and never by his Sahaba after Rasul Allah (Salallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam). The grave also does not belong to Rasul Allah (Salallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam)
Please avoid circulating such messages

Atif Latif replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 08:47 PM PST 

What do mean that grave does no belong to Rasul Allah (Peace Be Upon Him)?

moram replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 12:48 AM PST 

Silent Majority needs to wake up. Otherwise it is just a matter of time before the likes of mm would come and tell us to conform to their ways. These guys bombed Rehman Baba. There is no tolerance in their version of religion. For them, its 'my way or no way'! In Germany, silent majority kept quiet and Hitler took over. The religious fascists are coming down the mountains into the plains now!!

Friend replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:28 AM PST 

mm sahib,

If this is a Bidat then we are happy with this Bidat. Mind your own business!

Observer replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:40 AM PST 

mm

Do not celebrate if you dont want.

Also do not interfere in other people's business.

anwar ahmed replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:54 AM PST 

MM no need to show ur prejudice nature. People like u have very little knowldge abt Islam but always try to be Allama. We celeberate Eid milad u- nabi* Sallalla ho Alihi waslam) wid great respect and honour and will celebrate it wid the last breath. InshAllah.

SultanTipu replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 05:35 AM PST 

Kaash hum Nabi Paak sallahu alaihe wasallam kai ahkamat ki pairwi mein bhi yahi jazba dikhaatai!
Deen mein apni marzi nahi chalai gi.
RasoolaAllah SAW ka itteba karna ho ga.Chahai dil ko mushkil lagai.
Deen ko apni tabiyat aur marzi kai mutabiq dhalnai ki bajai apnai aap ko deen kai mutabiq dhaliyai.
Allah hum sab ko RasoolAllah SAW ka itteba karnai ki taufeeq dai.

Observer replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:46 AM PST 

Sultan Tipu

Why are you repeating the molvi stuff for the sake of it.

Just let the people decided whats good for them and stop lecturing.

Advisor replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:52 AM PST 

Well done guys!
mm, Islam teaches us tolerance and patience. Please please do not spread hate on this forum. We have enough troubles from nonsense and illiterate Talibans and for sure we don’t need more.

May Allah give you wisdom to choose the right path!

mehrtex replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 02:00 PM PST 

AA,
MM IS A WAHABI AND TRY TO FORCE AHLE-SUNNAT TO FOLLOW THEM.
PEOPLE LIKE THEM CELEBRATE THEIRE OWN BIRTDAYS.
BUR WHEN WE CELEBRATE EID-E-MILAD-UN-NABI THEY SAY ITS BIDA.
GROW UP MM EVEN ANGLES CELEBRATE MILAD-E-MUSATFA.
UNTIL THE DAY OF JUDGEMENT TRUE MUSLIMS WILL CELEBRATE MILAD-E-MUSTAFA.
>
(38302)
Tuesday, March 10, 2009 03:25 PM PST 
Eid_e_ Milad_un_Nabi Mubarak (Salallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam)

To all brothers and sisters

<= Click to see Inside View of Roza-e-Rasool (S)
>
(38301)
Tuesday, March 10, 2009 02:45 PM PST 
Broadway commercial prices

I have seen discussions on the prices of 8 marla commercial plots in DHA Lahore's Broadway commercial. Adil said prices have dropped as low as 1.3 crores. Are the quoted prices for fully paid plots because I noticed that the instalments on these plots were to be paid until Feb 2010?? However, if the buyer would have to pay the remaining instalments then the real price is very different from what it sounds like!
>
(38300)
Tuesday, March 10, 2009 02:41 PM PST 
Effect of global financial crisis, political circus on Pakistan Market

i havnt been to Pakistan for a year now and wanted to know what is all the crisis's affects on the property market.

How have prices and demand and supply been affected?

And there still buyers?


have construction costs come down due to prices decreases in raw materials?
>
(38299)
Tuesday, March 10, 2009 01:19 AM PST 
Foreign currency account !

I live in saudi arabia and want to open a foreign currency account in any reputable bank of Pakistan. Can it be done from here through mail.I don't think we have any Pakistani Bank operating here.I would appreciate if someone could give a clue.

s.a.malik uk replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 02:01 AM PST 

u can open an ublfc account while u r out of the country.
>
(38298)
Tuesday, March 10, 2009 12:07 AM PST 
Sell Commercial Land

Dear Sir,

For sell land mane high way Garrison,52250,Pakistan area its commercial land 8 Kanal 43520 Sq Ft, Front G.T. Road 176 ft and right side 30 ft wide Road its corner plot.
Its ideal location for any warehouse and display center any Hotel, any Collge etc.


Please see location on satellite map
http://maps.google.com/maps?t=h&key=ABQIAAAAxq5Zhb...


Evershine Enterprises
10-Iqbal Gunj, Collage Road
Gujranwala.
Phone:
Fax:

Thanks Best Regards.
Zia
>
(38297)
Monday, March 9, 2009 11:42 PM PST 
Newly built 3 bed/4bath 500 sq yd house in PWD Coloney

Ad Type
City
Scheme
Demand(Rs)
For Sale
Rawalpindi
PWD
95 lac
Please note I am advertising on the behalf of a deceased friend. Therefore the price is reasonably priced for a quick sell. Please note that the house currently has a bank loan, which will be cleared as part of the sale process.

- House size 500 Sq Yard
- Newly build (July 2008)
- 3 bed/4 bath house in PWD
- Very reasonable price
- The PWD colony is only 2.5 kilometers from Airport off of Islamabad Hwy

Please contact Mr Irshad directly at:
Alternatively please contact me at
>
(38296)
Monday, March 9, 2009 09:33 PM PST 

A house in I-8/4 is available for rent
Ground floor with 3beds drg, dining,sitting and parking space, rent 850 US$ P/Month.
and Ist floor with 2beds,drg,dining and sitting with separate gate and parking place.rent 650 US $
e- mail

Isloo replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 07:37 AM PST 

Is it on 500 Yards ? How old is the construction? Rent looks on very high end actually !!!
>
(38295)
Monday, March 9, 2009 05:06 PM PST 
>
(38294)
Monday, March 9, 2009 03:32 PM PST 
DHA Valley Islamabad Article in The News Mar 8 2009

<<<<< DHA Valley Islamabad newspaper article scan from The News Mar 8 2009

Ejaz replied on Monday, March 9, 2009 04:52 PM PST 

These kind of things will always happen. The overseas Pakistanis always wish and want to settle(at least their families in Pakistan). They become much more loving and caring towards Pakistan as compared to the time when they were in Pakistan.

So OPF, Bahria, and DHA exploit the same WISH of Overseas Pakistanis and promise to give them a SWEET HOME in Pakistan. But just explore all those schemes which were announced for OVERSEAS PAKISTANI, they never materialized and my innocent fellows lost their money and still can't have a house in Pakistan..............so.....we........just decide urself why all this is happening...no one can question to those authorities....So just waittttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt

Sh replied on Monday, March 9, 2009 05:26 PM PST 

I can't understand one thing, 1st they ask charge with application (non-refundable) then after the balloting they ask 27000 each to pay to open file, what is all this greed? And, presently you see that if you (by chance / need) want to sell the same,
prices are below a lot. When honesty will be prime purpose of all in our society? DHA its our hard saved money, why you do so to take it away? What is this 27000 to open file, if it is on computer it will take 05 minutes to maintain data, 05 to open a file in cabinet........... DHA is using its name to looooooting us, poor pakistanis

Aamir replied on Monday, March 9, 2009 09:33 PM PST 

Two possible reasons for a bad investment.
1)Unawareness
0r
2)Greediness

This web site does cover the first reason but can't do about the Second.

Aamir replied on Wednesday, August 27, 2008 07:58 AM PST

1. Some property dealers in Islamabad are misguiding people that just after the ballot of DHA valley Islamabad, the 8 Marla plots will sell @ 40-45 Lacs. The same property dealers are selling (Black Marketing) Application Forms @ Rs. . However the information being spread is void of any truth and less informed people are being ripped off.

2. The fact of the matter is that one Kanal plots in DHI ext-2 are available in the market @ Rs. 13-16 lacs which makes it impossible for the 8 Marla plots to sell even @ Rs. 20 Lacs.

3. In first place, any extension phase of DHI may be avoided for being intangible that’s why all the plots/
files in these phases are less than half of worth once these plots used to be. (from 35 to 16 Lacs).

4. Numbers of plots to be balloted are less than 400, whereas, the applicants are more than 2 lacs. More chances are that you will loose your Rs.8000/5000, or you will end up in dead investment. Examples of extension phases stand witness to this effect. Therefore, in either case you are a looser.

5. I just want to highlight that if you wish to buy DHA Valley plots, the same would be available at original price, expectedly even for less, after few months of the ballot. Therefore, how wise it is going back and forth, buying application forms in black and fulfilling all the documentation formalities, when the same could be achieved easily after the ballot with a plus point of selecting a location of your choice

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Monday, March 9, 2009 09:59 PM PST 

First they create an artificial shortage then they blackmail the poor needy people by exploiting their genuine needs. The socio-economic fabric of the Pakistani society is in the GRIP of the elites. I equate elitism as the same as yazidism. Karballa was not just an isolated incident. It was a message till eternity for humans warning us of the elitism system adored by Muslim societies.

Aamir replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 02:35 AM PST 

@Faisal
An elite is one who is in better socio-ecnomoc conditions. Elitism is everywhere in the world. It was,is and will remain so because of the economic differential amongst the masses. It is not the elitism but exploitation which makes the less fortune people suffer. Anybody, whether elite or normal can exploit others when in position to do so. The real curse in pakistan is injuctic,suppression, expolitation and unequal human rights. Hazrat Ali said a socisty can withstand Kufr but can't survive in the face of injustice.
To me, the reason of the success of estern nations is that they extend equal rights to elite and regular citizens.

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 03:11 AM PST 

Aamir: I am not some daddoo living in a cave. I have also traveled and lived in some countries. There is nowhere a TABKA system and elitism like in Pakistan. You rightly say that real curse in Pakistan is injustice, suppression, exploitation, unequal human rights, but who is doing all these things? Elites in Pakitan became so powerful because God created them superior? Of course not. If that is true then you are saying that 2% people had more brains, made more efforts at hard work to gain their socio-economic conditions? Of course not! It's the unjust socio-economic system that they exploited to their advantage. This is called elitism. When the top tabka people don't let anybody else survive and grab hold to whatever they can, hoard for the next thousand years, become qabza groups, don't let anybody else to have equal standard education, health, opportunities, that's called elitism.

Do you think Europ/USA got their true freedom for free? They also had a tabka system and elitism until two to three hundred years ago. Their ordinary people fought bloody revolutions with their own elites, if you know your history. Today even our low classes want to go their to live. While the elitism system feeds the masses with confusion, misleads them deliberately, because elitism is an animal that evolves with time, to keep up pace with humanity.

SAY NO TO TABKA SYSTEM!

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 03:22 AM PST 

Mr. Aamir: For fifteen years i am writing against Capitalism. The educated people used to mock me, tell me I'm stupid, i don't know anything. Today the champions of Capitalism like Soros, Buffet, and others are talking against it!

I don't want to mock anyone. I don't want anything for myself. I just KNOW the real reasons of Pakistan's problems. Ok, then, tell me, despite so much efforts being put in by various organizations, people, etc., why are the problems increasing? Answer: Because the various methods being put in the system for eliminations of the various problems is ACTUALLY acting as the catalyst for making it worse!

You know, nowhere in the world does capitalism exist as in Pakistan. Even the inventors of Capitalism support the socio-economics of their society with non-capitalist or socialist values.

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 03:27 AM PST 

sorry, i hope you don't mind my use of the word "daddoo". I don't even know what it means. No hard feelings please.

Friend replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 03:30 AM PST 

Dear Faisal Naseer (Ali3)
Don't you think that Soros and Buffet are Soros and Buffet because of the Captitalism?

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 04:50 AM PST 

Friend: Exactly!!!! That's my whole point! That's why it's not a good system. Because it only creates two Buffet and Soros and ignores the rest, and you seem to be impressed with this system because you see the shine and glamor of a few top class people at the expense of the nation (i'm talking of Pakistan, not USA). I call it a "whitewash" economy. They whitewash the main road buildings, give wealth to 2% of the society, make all the shine and glamor, and tell the world, come and see our success! That's why capitalism is easy. You have to concentrate only on building 2% of the society while 98% pays for it. The debate here is not about Buffet and Soros but for all the citizens on an equal scale. Socialism is not so easy to manage, and doesn't look so interesting either because there's no shine and glamor.

I once wrote on this site about the formulas of Capatilism, in the days when Musharraf and Shaukat used to travel the world (on our expense) and boast to them, "Come, look at our success! We have doubled the per capita income of Pakistan!!!"

Imagine there's a room with a hundred people in it. Give Rs.100 to one and nothing to the others. What is the total income of that room? Rs. 100. What is the per capita income? Rs.1. Ok, now give another Rs.100 to the same person whom you had given Rs. 100 before and give nothing to the other 99 people. What is the total income of the room now? Rs. 200. What is the per capita income of that room? Rs. 2
DOUBLE!!

Now on a lighter note, to explain more about elitism and tabka system:

Look at the matrimonial classifieds. "Seeking Doctor for 45 years old girl". Why doctor? Is she ill? For some time the reader, if he's not used to our system, can become confused that maybe he's reading in the health related classifieds. "Girl is domesticated". Domesticated? What does that mean? I remember reading that word in the pet's section. "Boy can be 45 to 60 years old. Only parents of boy must
contact girl's parents. Boy must be living in POSH area. Girl has USA visa." That's a plus point if she has USA visa. Posh area is very important. I even heard some families have to rent houses in posh areas for few months so that their children can get married. They also ask for a particular caste (breed), "established" family (elite family?), etc. I can go on and on.

I've never heard of these things in western marriages. They only look for love, honest good character, that's all. Not even stable job or high paying profession. Here the people say we are just trying to secure our child's future. Hey, are you God? How can you secure your child's future? All over the world people get married. Nobody plans it in this way, that they calculate how much salary will be coming for how many years, etc. In Pakistan and other Muslim countries even two real brothers marry their children so that their wealth can remain in the family. Everything is about wealth. Even two business people marry their children on the basis of how much advantage they can get in their business.

One of the central pleasure of elitism is that only "we" are the elites. If everybody becomes equal to us then it takes out the fun from our being the elites.

Face it. It's the facts about us. Truth can be bitter. I know it's not easy to let go of elitism. It has that special "clinging" effect with it. That's why it developed itself in this way. It's an "alive" system.

aa replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 07:20 PM PST 

faisal naseer(ali3) i personally think you have made several miscalculations to reach one wrong conclusion that capitalism is root of all evil, and socialism is solution for every thing....
there are several things which are fundamentally wrong with socialism as well thats why it failed miserably...
1- every one is not born equal.. people who work hard and make good decisions have right to be rewarded for there hard work...
what happened in socialism that there is no financial rewards for hard work...so no body desires to work hard...ghar baithay rooti kisay bori lagti hay...
2-your assumption about western marriages is wrong again...in fact most marriages in west are for financial reasons...they dont need to marry for other reasons any way as that can be arranged without marriage....more than 60-70 percent end in divorce...situation is totally different in islamic world where greater than 99 percent are running... successfully or un successfully.... i am not saying that our social attitudes surrounding these things are right as we especially in pakistan have picked up hindu traditions to extent that our islamic identity is being threatened by them....but your persumption that westerns are angels is hilarious....
they are also criminals....unfortunately they are more successful criminals than us at the moment....
also for God sake.. forget socialism now... a system that did not last 80 years...which was responsible for slaughters of millions of people....and keeping millions more in poverty is hardly ideal... even today in europe the old eastern block countries are far more poor than rich western block countries...some of old communist european countries are even poorer that india and pakistan for God sake....

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 08:44 PM PST 

aa: i dont even know what you are reading. I never said those words that you are quoting me with. as i said in the begining, this is a uselss discussion. also, i think you are brain washed by the propoganda in our countries. like, in mosques usually you will hear those things you just said. few days ago i was sitting in a barber shop (in DHA, not tora bora) and the man sitting next to me, he was not even a mullah, he was saying, "people in western countries are all living like animals", etc. etc. I listened to some time then i said excuse me sir, but i disagree with you. he became angry and said i dont know anything. he knows for sure that western people are all living like dogs and cats and all of them are animals and they have no family system, and there is incest in every family, they dont respect their parents, etc. See what i mean? I asked him if he has ever been to any western country? he said no.

maybe you have not seen the old age homes in Pakistan where many parents who have been expelled by their children are living?

angels? i said that? you must be drunk. drunk with brainwashed propaganda. it's obvious that you have to resort to lies to support your debate. because you have nothing to say if you stick to the truth.

socialism is solution for everything? i said that?

Please, please, what and who am i dealing with here? i said in the beginning elites won't let go so easily. either you are an elite or in the influence of their propaganda.

i'm not even going to reply to this post again because i know it's useless in dealing with elites. i already am spreading my message against the elites to the public, and i shall continue doing it, no matter how many obstacles i have to face. even my life is available for the people of Pakistan.

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 08:51 PM PST 

aa: you dont know a single thing about socialist or even western countries. i have lived in both. do you know the kind of criminals that exist in our society? Where in the world can you find people who sell even FAKE BABY milk, fake life saving medicines, cut of noses of their own women for honor, force entire families to march naked with shaven heads in bazars, burry people alive, feed them dogs, write of trillions and still have respect but arrest poor for Rs.50,000 loan and take hostage their women as slaves, deliberately not provide equal standard education, health and sports to children, show our teeth in smiles to western white race but feel insulted in being in the company of our own if they are poor.

i know there are criminals in western countries too. but there, they are criminals. here, the criminals are respectable people of society like you and me. there, the criminals hide from police and from their families in shame. here, the system protects the biggest dakoos, usurpers,

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 11:55 PM PST 

aa: You were born superior? Are you from a superior race? What are you called? Humans plus? Everybody should be given equal opportunity. In Pakistan the elites survive by sucking blood out of the 160 million population.

person who works hardest in Pakistan is mazdoor class. There goes your analysis and calculation down the drain. hehe.

You should see the movie "Trading Places".

Will you be able to marry your daughter with your driver's son? Oh, that's too much to ask for. Can you have your massi sit at the same table with your family when you are having dinner? Surprised? But it's actually happening in other countries. Are there separate residential areas for massi, driver and the director of the company in other countries?

I know you cannot let go of elitism. It's like a second skin on your body.

bb replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 01:41 AM PST 

top up your meds faisal and c ur psych....dont wory about west or socialismm too much

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 02:36 AM PST 

bb: you don't even have the courage to post your real name! i challenge you to a public debate and let the public decide who needs meds and psych. Maybe you don't know enough English or maybe you didn't take your meds today because NOWHERE i have written in my life that i "worry about west or socialism"! As usual, the animal of elitism is at work again by deliberately creating lies and confusions.

bb replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 06:55 AM PST 

bro there is no animal here...please seek some help.... just kidding ....cool man

Faisal Naseer (Ali3) replied on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 05:04 PM PST 

sorry, i didn't call you an animal but the way i phrased my words can give a misunderstanding. if you would have read all my previous posts regards elitism you would know what i am talking about.
>
(38293)
Monday, March 9, 2009 02:47 PM PST 
PLOT FOR SALE

Ad Type
City
Scheme
Block
Plot
Size
Demand(Rs)
Features
For Sale
Faisalabad
Milat Town
B
82
30*60
950000
Ready For Construction
>
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